Don’t Copy India! ~ Toongi Dasi

Via on Apr 11, 2012
steven depolo

Why India’s dichotomous householder/brahmachari model doesn’t work–for them, or us.

My guru was 11 years old when his marriage was arranged in his village somewhere in the rural interior of the state of Bihar, India. Of course the actual wedding and consequent living together with his wife did not occur until he was older, probably somewhere between mid-teens to early twenties. Years later, he would leave his family to take sannyasa, voluntary vows of renunciation. Many years later still, I would go to India, meet him, take diksha (formal initiation into mantra-sadhana) and live in his ashram.

Those times spent in his ashram were the happiest of my life. Almost three years after meeting him and taking diksha he would go on his first “world tour” out of India to teach foreigners about Bhakti. After that first tour every year saw more and more foreigners from around the world coming to his humble ashrams in the famous Braj area of India (Mathura-Vrindavan, Uttar Pradesh), where Radha and Krishna sported their divine play (leela) 5,000 or so years ago. As a result, the ashrams gradually became more crowded and more “westernized.”

I remember clearly one incident that gave me a little shock (I admit to being somewhat of a prude by nature).  A middle aged couple nearing 50 who were not married came to the ashram and set up their tent on the roof of the ashram in order to live there for a month.  Gurudeva knew they were not married and yet he allowed them to sleep together in the ashram which was traditionally inhabited by brahmacharis (single, assumed to be celibate men and women), and the occasional married couple.

After a while of staying at the ashram the couple thought it would be cool to have a traditional Indian style commitment ceremony inside the temple (though they were not legally married, or ever became so). I remember clearly the Indian brahmacharis and other locals affectionately joking with one another about their age and how unusual and strange it is to see people “so old” getting into a relationship, what to speak of having a formal Indian fire sacrifice to affirm their commitment. Nonetheless, the ashram hosted their ceremony and feast and a pleasant time was had by all.

Part of the amusement for the locals was that this particular relationship model; middle aged, living together without being legally or religiously married, having a fire sacrifice at such a ripe old age past one’s peak fertility years, was in direct opposition to their model which has been in existence for hundreds if not thousands of years; two young, fertile people, most likely both virgins/brahmacharis who have never even dated, what to speak of having shacked-up, coming together at the behest of their elders to religiously wed with the express purpose of preserving society, culture and the propagation of the species.

Steve Hicks

I’ll admit that yours truly, being young, prudish and very much influenced by the local culture at the time, was also quite amused, if not bemused. One thing that I did note however was that our guru, who perhaps out of all of us came from the most traditional, orthodox and conservative background, seemed to think nothing of it and gave his complete blessings and affections to the couple from the time they showed up at our ashram doorsteps. He didn’t blink an eye when this unmarried couple set up tent on the roof or asked for a fire sacrifice at their “advanced age.”

Over the years and travels with my guru I would witness what was at the time a more liberal approach to relationships than the one even I as an American was raised with. (My parents were against shacking up before marriage, as many of their generation. Things have changed since).

While in India he honored the cultural norms of that country, when dealing with his non-Indian disciples he conceded that different cultures have different relationship models. Though one thing he was consistent about across cultures was staying together and trying your best to make things work once a commitment was made. Even then, he understood that there are some circumstances in which even that is impossible.

I very much appreciated and agreed with Lakshmi Nair’s two recent elephant journal articles (here and here) about brahmacharya. One of the biggest culture shocks of my life was experienced not when I went to India but when I returned to the USA again, and that was the complete taboo that the subject of celibacy is here, and that too within yoga circles themselves!

No matter the yoga studio, the seminar, the workshop, whatever, I found the most frequently talked about thing was “relationships”–and by relationships they meant of the romantic/sexual kind, not platonic or otherwise.  All ages–whether teens, adults, or elderly persons in their viagra/cialis years, all age groups are talking about “relationships.”

I remember giving one yoga class to some American women and talking about brahmacharya and one of them exclaimed, “who in the world would want to be celibate and why?!”  I had no answer!  The idea of being single, happy alone, drama-free and satisfied without sex was lost on her. I realized I’d have to revamp my presentation for a demographic wherein the benefits of either short or long term brahmacharya are not collectively known.

On the opposite and far other extreme of the spectrum I give you the result of a brahmacharya that is culturally enforced against the will of the people, and that is eve-teasing. Eve-teasing is India’s euphemism for “street sexual harassment” which has reached epidemic proportions across the sub-continent. You can read about it and what India’s women (and some men) are doing to fight back here.

It’s a major problem in the area my guru’s ashram is located in. I remember going on short trips to other parts of India just to get a break from it all. My first night in Mumbai (Bombay) I was shocked to see young couples on Marine Drive cuddled up, hugging and kissing. Remember, India is a country where PDAs (public displays of affection) remain illegal in some areas.  But after the initial shock I reasoned, “this is a good thing. Those young men are too preoccupied with their girlfriends to harass me. I feel safe here”.

Contrast that with the area further north I had just come from wherein the local police staff of Meerut, U.P, were commissioned to crack down on eve-teasers and they instead went after consensual couples – all for showing a lil’ PDA in public!  Please see news report here.

The villages, small towns, and second tier cities of India remain places without any socially accepted dating culture.  Hence you have unmarried singles in the prime of their lives who are denied the physical and emotional affections of romantic relationships. That denial can extend all the way into their late 20s or even 30s if their parents are unable to arrange marriages until that time.  A recipe for frustration?  What do you think?

Moreover, in these same areas the few non-married consensual relationships that do manage to emerge are given almost the same treatment as non-consensual eve-teasers, as exemplified in this video,  where Operation Majnun officers are stalking and roughing up free citizens of India (and asking some to do exercises on the spot holding their ears!) simply for enjoying each other’s company in a park!

Meena Kadri

The reason for this is the grihasta/brahmachari or householder/celibate lifestyle model that India continues to abide by, more or less (exceptions are there).

In this model, as Lakshmi Nair pointed out, the brahmachari stage of life is during one’s youth when studies take precedent over everything else.  After that stage of life one is meant to enter the grihasta or householder stage; marriage, family, career, what is often referred to as “samsara” or the binding cycle.

Many in India see no middle ground between these two extremes and that is why in this modern age of extended college education where we remain students often up until our mid-20s and sometimes beyond, the culture expects one to remain brahmachari, or celibate, well into one’s adult years without break!  The break comes only with marriage.

For those of us with low libidos that’s not difficult.  But how many low libido or asexual people are there in the population? Exactly. Very few. Forget libido, this doesn’t even begin to address the positive emotional impact a romantic relationship can have on the human psyche. Nor does such an either/or model address the many individuals who desire neither marriage nor family, but are not eager to sign up for lifelong celibacy when they are just barely out of their teens either. Where do they fit in? And what about all the LGBT people in the global yoga scene?

By collectively giving only two extreme options to the entire population across the board, and those options are either;

1. Marriage, family, complete samsara with all its subsequent duties, or
2. Complete celibacy and single life.

A society sets up a situation wherein a moderate middle ground is shamed at the same level sexual crimes are shamed.  In other words, healthy, consensual relationships between legal-aged but unmarried adults carry almost the same, and sometimes more, stigma in (many parts of) India as non-consensual crimes like sexual harassment do!

This is not a healthy model to be exported globally, and certainly not healthy for the yoga community to adopt.

In our eagerness to reform some ethical breaches in the international yoga scene, let us not go to the other end of the extreme and begin to repress, shame and stigmatize consensual relationships between adults whether they be young, old, or in between–yoga teachers or not.

By demonizing consensual relationships we run the risk of creating a breeding ground for non-consensual harassment to bloom just below the surface and replicate itself to epidemic proportions.

Don’t throw baby Gopal out with the bath water!

editor: Greg Eckard

______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Toongi Dasi is a third culture person who has lived most of her adult life in India studying the literature and lore of Bengali Vaishnavism under the guidance of her guru. She currently resides in the United States where she teaches meditation techniques and dishes out unsolicited advice to the lovelorn in the tradition of Vatsyayana, the celibate sex guru of Kama Sutra fame. She can be reached on email here.

About elephant journal

elephant journal is dedicated to "bringing together those working (and playing) to create enlightened society." We're about anything that helps us to live a good life that's also good for others, and our planet. >>> Founded as a print magazine in 2002, we went national in 2005 and then (because mainstream magazine distribution is wildly inefficient from an eco-responsible point of view) transitioned online in 2009. >>> elephant's been named to 30 top new media lists, and was voted #1 in the US on twitter's Shorty Awards for #green content...two years running. >>> Get involved: > Subscribe to our free Best of the Week e-newsletter. > Follow us on Twitter Fan us on Facebook. > Write: send article or query. > Advertise. > Pay for what you read, help indie journalism survive and thrive—and get your name/business/fave non-profit on every page of elephantjournal.com. Questions? info elephantjournal com

1,574 views

Appreciate this article? Support indie media!

(We use super-secure PayPal - but don't worry - you don't need an account with PayPal.)

31 Responses to “Don’t Copy India! ~ Toongi Dasi”

  1. CB says:

    very interesting article! I think you make an excellent point that sometimes we brought up in Vedic culture, or Indians in general, make the mistake of polarizing it, as either “celibate forever” or “get married quick.” I myself have this problem, even. But there is ntohing wrong in being with someone if you are both keeping GOd at the center; that is still a spiritiual relationship, it doesn’t have to involve PDA or be degrading in any way; it can be spiritiual.

    Still figuring this one out myself…doing the “brahmacarini” thing at the moment, but I’m in my early 20s, we’ll see…I’d like to think I can do this forever, but I don’t know if I have that much sense control.

    Thanks for the article!

  2. Thaddeus Haas Thaddeus1 says:

    This is a wonderful and thought provoking piece, not to mention intelligently written.

    Having just returned from my first extended trip to India, I deeply resonant with opinion. While India has many wonderful and magical things to offer, it could definitely use a new of glasses regarding relationships. Perhaps your guru provides the clearest and best example by simultaneously being rooted in tradition with the ability to see to the core with his understanding of the principles and their application to how we choose to relate.

    Thank you for this offering.

  3. Renata says:

    Quite informative article, with a lot of data and social inside from both cultures, very good conclusion, however I think that the punch line should have been a bit stronger and perhaps a bit more discussed. All in all very good and solid article. The secret of all is: balance and live and let other live.

  4. Tanya Lee Markul Tanya Lee Markul says:

    Posted to Elephant Yoga on Facebook and Twitter.

    Tanya Lee Markul, Yoga Editor
    Like Elephant Yoga on Facebook
    Follow on Twitter

  5. Valerie Carruthers ValCarruthers says:

    Just posted to "Featured Today" on the Elephant Spirituality Homepage.

    Valerie Carruthers
    Please go and "Like" Elephant Spirituality on Facebook

  6. Gaurangi-priya says:

    Very though provoking! It's all about balance.

  7. Sakhi says:

    Well written article Toongi. Having lived in India I am well aware of all these cultural oddities, but people following some forms of yoga and have never been to India will no doubt learn a lot from your article. I don't think any of us have to fear the present Indian cultural model appearing in any country, especially not a Third World or developing country. I would like to talk about the subject of Brahmacharya, but it would take more time and effort than I am currently capable of.

  8. Lakshmi says:

    Yes..the thing is that in the ancient days, the householder stage often started pretty early in life, so maybe they didn't run into the issues of extended brahmacharya like we do now. Also, we don't live such structured lives in neatly defined phases. But I also think (as I mentioned in our discussion over on my article that modern Indian culture is not necessarily true to the spirit of brahmacharya either due to layers upon layers of colonial, political, and patriarchal oppression. And this varies so much from region to region, as you mentioned, and is very much influenced by the political and social culture of the region. I really think brahmacharya ideally means having deep respect for sexuality and its sacred power. It may just be practical to abstain from sex when you are trying to focus on other things like developing the mind. But in our modern age, where, as you mentioned, extended studies means extending abstinence far longer than is reasonable to expect from the average person, then the abstinence itself might cause too much restlessness and distraction, which is certainly not the intention, and is probably in fact counterproductive to any sort of spiritual pursuits. I think in the real sense, brahmacharya is much more than just abstinence…it is abstinence if and when abstinence feels natural and appropriate (such as between teachers and students, etc.) and it is respect and mindfulness when in a consensual relationship. Your guru understood the true meaning…goonda policewalas definitely don't, but I wouldn't call that Indian culture necessarily…I think that is just corruption, and unfortunately there is a lot of that in modern India.

    Thank you for the reference to my articles!

  9. Indu says:

    Good article Toongi. It just comes down to cultural differences and there's not a lot people can do to change that except globalisation, which is doing a good job. I have to say that I'm anti-brahmacarya these days, at least for people who've no background in the concept from their birth i.e. westerners. I don't see that it works or that there's any point to spending a period of time getting hung up over sex, which is what happens when people force abstinence on themselves. People who've been taught that sexual abstinence is a good thing carry that into their relationships, and unfortunately interpret the traditional Indian model into meaning that one sees one's partner as a 'friend' with whom to carry out spiritual practices at best, and as a distraction from spiritual emancipation at worst. Because it seems to be mostly men who try the brahmacari thing, (as women are generally encouraged to seek a husband) a huge imbalance occurs in which women are seen as 'the witch maya',(another misunderstanding of Indian spiritual thought) and they become the underdog. As a westerner, I have had to go full circle to realise that celibacy shouldn't be encouraged – just available to those who feel drawn to it by nature. Even during more religious times in Britain, only a very small portion of the religious congregation would become monks and nuns. As Gaurangi priya says above – it's all about balance.

  10. I'd rather hear about how her relationship with her Guru changed her, and the inspiring experiences she had with him….
    than the psycho-madness of peoples thinking processes "should I shouldn't I" with regards to sex. Who cares? Sex is a personal thing, relationship is a choice…. everyone is free to make their own decisions in these regards. It's a personal journey, and a private one. No one should be judged. A-sexuality is as a cool as any other choice, marriage is helpful as it protects girls from getting into too many sexual relationships and losing their grace, Brahmacari is a choice, and one encouraged by Gurudeva….. why? Sexual freedom has made sluts out of the society of woman, and is not freedom at all, it is a prison of the senses and desire…. that creates births and more births, unwanted children, broken hearts and women with intimacy issues…..

    Let's hear more about Gurudeva and your experiences with him Toongi, now that I can really enjoy! We're all eagerly awaiting something deeper.

  11. indu says:

    I think, with regards to the above comment, that Toongi writes these articles to encourage this kind of discussion. No-one outside of a small group of people knows who her Gurudeva is, and let's face it, people are more interested in issues that are pertinent to them in some way and make them think about reality.

  12. shaktipetal says:

    Well Written Toongi.!
    I think these kinds of discussions are very important for society to progress to a more loving and accepting way of life.
    Having been to India,and seen the things you are pointing out, I must confess they were very disturbing to me as a western woman. However,that being said, many of the cultural traditions in India are most charming and I long to have some of them in my daily world. Here in the west women are exposed at a very early age to "freedom" in dating and relationships when they are not prepared emotionally or spiritually to take on the task. The result is often heartbreak or a numbing of the heart,which leaves them emotionally stunted. Many lose (and loose) all boundaries and have trouble maintaining intimate relationships. Celibacy or relationship is and should be a choice one makes when they are old enough to make a happy un-regretfull decision in life,not forced onto them.
    Thanks for taking the time to write. Keep it coming.

  13. Mansa says:

    i was wondering how have you established a relationship between celibacy and eve-teasing.

  14. Mansa says:

    so is it according to you all Indian men and women are forced to practice celibacy? The sexual frustration is heightened because of these constraints?

    There are many more stakeholders to be analysed to built up your argument. This might be
    true of a very limited population, what facts do you have, was your Guru frustrated or were the people in the ashram.

  15. maji says:

    Is like you mentioned Toongi- you were from a family that believed in marriage and not living together before that- so this issue isn't really about India culture vs. American culture or any other culture. Human culture means responsibility. If there are no set standards- at least to know about- then the influence of Kaliyuga will be that gradually over time human life will be non-different than animal life. We all know how animals live so there is no need to go into that. But as a yoga teacher you really need to learn the values of celibacy. In Western culture there is no glory in the golden years of life- that is 50 years and beyond. If spiritual life hasn't been cultivated yet- then these older people should be encouraged to be celibate and begin a serious spiritual life. Have you noticed there are no old people in america? Everyone wants to be a youthful teen-ager and dress and act like one too! We have a culture of wrinkled old worn out teen-agers trying to squeeze out every bit of enjoyment they can. When old age could be a great chance to develop spiritual life and detachment from this body. Even your students who are younger need to know the goal and aim of yoga – so that there is a clear conception of what people can do after they are no longer young, beautiful and obsessed with enjoying. Even for a young person there are many rules- and they keep a person pious and actually beautiful. Nothing destroys youth and beauty more that a licentious life style. Will Kali Maharaj have his way? – surely- but teachers of divine culture and knowledge of yoga should at least teach the good old fashion wisdom of the sages.

  16. Appease? hungry my niggas XD

  17. how does aisha short want to ingest ‘favors’?? she utilised to change moral values n? each that be4 aright??? WTF is up wid this demo?

  18. The only reason reason Iraq is allay titled Iraq is? because of our adynamic leaders in the US. If they did it the artefact it inevitably to be finished terrorsism would be other History content. It is not a concern of unfitness. it is many a matter of international semipolitical push. I head’t conceive you change the slightest content of what the US is surefooted. . . But, you are lone as strong as your weakest circuit. Unfortuneately, Obama is that adynamic connectedness.

  19. The full of the Mid Eastward has been a warzone change before Aks and Weapon Launchers were provided. Transgress betwixt Buddhists? and Muslims on the India/Pakistan border. Conflicts with the Jews between the 1950s and now, complete borders and living space (really just religion). The US because of its hold for Israel, besides as its guild that goes comfortably against the Islamic philosophy of Shariah (homoeroticism, freedom of action, layperson authorities, barbed civilians).

  20. no they custom dont beam a? false message

  21. irksome Deadening Deadening, Dull. Ekta’s dramas are? geting so irksome, i expectation she boodle fashioning serials.

  22. The US has fought these people earlier Irag and Afghanistan. In Jefferson’s Tenure, a bimestrial unrecoverable war was pledged, in the interest of protecting craft routes ‘tween Confederate Europe and Blue Africa and the US. US bourgeois sailors were constantly attacked by the Barbary Pirates (Muslim oceangoing farers who were? indellibly action loot and selling these sailors disconnected as slaves to the Intervening Oriental/African bond class). We responded with a sizeable blue and Marines. Foiled the Pirates swiftly.

  23. What the hell is grapeshot? ITS Purple? DRANK

  24. Saudi Arabia is even acknowledged money in the characteristic that it has the largest production in lubricator force and refining. Aforesaid as Kuwait. Of course, I dress’t hold with the cruel authorities, but as e’er, the US is only so brawny. We’re already gushing anorectic on troops. Does it look equivalent I actually agree with asleep civies? No, I dress’t, but as always, meliorate to understanding with the worst enemies, and? have the civvies emotion us, than to do null and feature them either leave, die from their have countrymen, or beg.

  25. how we touch women? act headscarf is often meliorate than existence a harlot. . you allow Black -who you impact liberally- go unclothed and sell their personal bodies. . and? I’m wondering, ground women do that instead of men??? what happened to the status???

  26. TD says:

    “Whats her hip on the shoulder?”

    That’s an asana from Kama Sutra. Part of my “personal story” and the reason I’m so “obsessed”.

    ;)

  27. yashoda devi dasi says:

    dandavat pranams; why there is no name of our "GURU"? YS, yashoda dd (croatian)-

Leave a Reply